STEP 6: File for the LMIA

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32 Comments
*Please Note: My experience with filing for the LMIA was based on the previous rules prior to Nov. 30, 2014, however I have updated the link to the current LMIA application forms and this post is still relevant under current rules.

Well here we are, after months of doing everything from considering the option of a live-in nanny, to interviewing, and completing the paperwork, it's all come together. It suddenly feels much more "real" when you get to this point. I just submitted the LMIA (Labor Market Impact Assessment) and I'm on the edge of my seat (and probably will be for 8-12 weeks) waiting to hear on our (hopefully) positive assessment.

I did plenty of research prior to completing the LMIA (Labor Market Impact Assessment) and the two tips I heard most were:

  1. Fill in everything!...If there's something that doesn't apply (like a fax number) write "n/a" but don't leave it blank. 
  2. Ensure that you provide all of the documentation. You don't want the whole process to be held up because you accidentally forgot to submit your son or daughter's long form birth certificate (or for submitting the short form instead), so pay attention to detail and submit everything that they ask for. 
All told, I was surprised at how straightforward the application was. I was expecting something very intimidating, and perhaps (at times) over my head, but it was very clear. I went above and beyond to provide every document that could be potentially useful. For example, the CRA still has my maiden name on file (even after changing it with Service Canada...a conundrum in itself) so I submitted a copy of my marriage license since the application cites my married name. The application asks for a rundown of where you advertised (to ensure that you've adequately searched for a Canadian worker) so I provided a document that listed all of the applications we received and categorized them as follows: Canadian citizens, permanent residents, individuals applying from out-of-country, then I further categorized them by incomplete (applications where only a resume, and no cover letter was submitted) and complete applications, and then once further by adequate (with childcare experience) and inadequate (no prior experience) applicants. I felt that this demonstrated the time that I took to thoroughly review all of the applications in search of a qualified Canadian worker. Now this may have been totally unnecessary, but when we have $1,000 and our son's childcare future on the line, I figure the extra organization and information seems like a good idea. 

Originally I had planned on sending the application by priority post, but once I determined that the address involves a P.O Box, I realized that perhaps this was unnecessary. My guess: they probably check the box once a week or so, thus priority post could be quite pointless. 

I am very much hoping that our application is processed quickly as time flies through this whole process. If there's one thing I've learned it's that it's never too early to start when you're thinking about hiring a live-in nanny. I thought I was so ahead of the game leaving myself 7 months, and here we are 2 months later and I've just submitted the LMIA because the truth is that each step (like filing with the Job Bank, but needing to wait two weeks for the CRA to send a PD7A in order to validate the account) takes so much longer than one might anticipate. I just hope everything gets done on time.

You can find the LMIA application HERE.

For more tips on filling out the LMIA, see my post on our positive LMO, click HERE. 





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32 comments:

  1. AnonymousOctober 11, 2014 at 5:21 AM

    Hi Jenn,
    Great blog with some really useful information. I'm wondering if you can answer a few of my questions:
    1) Do you have a specific phone number at the CIC that you've been using? I contacted Service Canada with a few questions and they weren't particularly knowledgeable about this process.
    2) Did you send original copies of your children's birth certificates as part of your LMIA application?
    3) Is it true that the nanny doesn't have to sign the copy of the contract that we submit?
    Thanks so much!
    Cindy

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    1. Jenn ElyseOctober 11, 2014 at 5:52 PM

      Hi Cindy,

      Thanks for your positive feedback on the blog! Here are the answers to your questions:

      1) There is indeed a number that is more specific than the Service Canada number. I wrote it down on some interviewing materials and am having trouble locating it, but will look in the next couple of days and post it if I find it, however you can access them by calling Service Canada and then telling them that you have specific Live-In Caregiver Program questions and they will transfer your call. When I originally spoke with the Service Canada representative, they really didn't know much about it either, but to be completely honest, even once I was transferred, the rep did give me some misinformation, but was more generally knowledgeable. I don't think it hurts to record the call (and let them know you're doing this) so that you always have documentation of what information was provided to you just in case it was something that impacted your application. Sometimes if you have specific questions your best bet is to ask those who have applied and gotten positive LMIA's (or post your question here, and I can research it for you. I will always mention when I am unsure of something vs. when I have concrete information)

      2) I sent a copy (not original) of my son's birth certificate. When you go to file for the LMIA, the website also provides a "Checklist" PDF that they ask you to include with your application. On the checklist, it specifies that there need only be a copy (not original) and that it must be the long form of the birth certificate.

      3) My understanding is that you don't need an original signed copy of the contract, however this did not come straight from a government source. I decided to trust in the numerous families that I had heard from who received positive LMIA's without a signed copy. Having said that, I decided to submit a scanned signed copy because it's so easy to just email the contract to your future nanny, have them print, sign, scan and return, and for me it provided extra reassurance.

      I hope I've answered your questions, but always feel free to get in touch should you have any further ones.

      Delete
  2. AnonymousOctober 17, 2014 at 7:54 AM

    Hi Jenn!

    Thanks for your prompt response to my questions. I really appreciate the help! I have a few more questions, if you don't mind.

    1) Did you post on the Cda Job Bank? It asked me for an anticipated start date and stipulated that the start date could be no greater than 3 months from the time of posting, so I entered December 1, 2014. This of course is much earlier than our nanny will be starting. Is it ok if there is a discrepancy between that date and the one I'm listing in the employer contract? I'm sure what to put as the start date in the employer contract. Any advice? Also, what should I put as the duration of contract?

    2) More employer contract questions: Are there guidelines about how much notice the employee needs to give for vacation requests, how much sick leave the employee is entitled to, and whether sick leave needs to be paid or unpaid? I couldn't find anything on this. What did you put for notice of resignation and notice for termination of employment. According to the guidelines, notice for both is dependent upon length of employment.

    Thanks again for all your help.

    Cindy

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    1. Jenn ElyseOctober 17, 2014 at 10:00 AM

      I never mind. :-) Answers below:

      1) a. Yes I did post to the Canadian Job Bank (which is mandatory), and I originally posted the job with the actual start date (Feb 2015). When the good folks at the job bank called me they mentioned that this is not allowed and the job bank representative said that he would post the job as start date: "as soon as possible". He said that this is what people post it as when they are completing the mandatory 14 day advertising requirement. As a result, the dates on our employer contract and that of the job bank don't match up either, but apparently (says the job bank rep) this is totally normal. We completed the contract with all honest information (ie. actual anticipated start date).

      1) b. In terms of the contract duration, we put two years. I called the ESDC to ask about this. I couldn't figure out what to put as the contract duration because it's difficult to know when you'll get pregnant again (if having more kids) or really when any other anticipated life event can take place, so the woman on the phone lead me to believe that I should put the maximum and said that I'd have to pay a second time to extend the work permit should I wish to keep the nanny beyond the initial contract (we were thinking two years). I later found out that this is NOT true. In order to extend a work permit, you do not need to pay the fee a second time. As such, we decided to go with a two year contract. We felt that this is appropriate in terms of a starting timeline for the nanny and would also be most accurate in terms of the gap we're planning between kids. We have thought about trying to keep the nanny on during my next maternity leave, or at least for some of it, and this leaves some leeway. Now some people feel that it is best just to put the maximum, but I personally opted for what I felt would be a more honest approach and put the length of time in the contract that we felt was most accurate which is also more fair (in my opinion) to the nanny so that they know what you are planning.

      2) I could not find guidelines for vacation requests (and given that mine have varied across different organizations), I don't think there are any. I believe (not positive) that sick leave is up to you. We went with 10 days/year. When I worked in social services, it was even higher because working directly with people means getting sick more often. I felt that 10 days would be fair. We also offered three weeks vacation. The minimum required is two weeks, but I get three weeks off so I figured I might as well offer three and the nanny and I will match our vacations. In terms of vacation, it is completely up to you whether you pay out 4% vacation pay or offer the actual paid time off. I've lived through both. My last employer paid out on every pay cheque but I was still allowed to take time off (just unpaid). I think most people find it easiest to just give the paid time off, but again, up to you. In terms of notice, it's as you say, depending on length of employment. We just went on the generous end of the spectrum and went with the amounts outlined for the longest length of employment. I personally, feel that with these items, it's best to air on the side of generosity. When we were landlords, we would always put a clause in leases that tenants could leave at any time, even during a year-long lease so long as they gave us 8 weeks notice. We always felt that having people live in a space against their will would have negative impacts. I feel the same way about employment.

      I hope this answers your questions, but as always, keep 'em coming if there are more. :-)

      Delete
  3. AnonymousOctober 21, 2014 at 6:47 PM

    Thanks, Jenn. Very helpful. I just posted a comment on your new post.

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    1. Jenn ElyseOctober 23, 2014 at 6:02 PM

      I found the Service Canada number that I was looking for. The number for the Live-in Caregiver Program (part of Temporary Foreign Worker Program at Employment and Social Development Canada) is 1-800-367-5693 and they are available to chat any time between 7am-8pm EST.

      Delete
  4. brigitteNovember 19, 2014 at 4:56 PM

    Hi Jenn, you have a very nice site.I enjoyed reading every detail.every topic is very helpful...I came here as a nanny..I stayed with such a wonderful family until I got my permanent residence card.Our relationship did not end just as nanny-employer relationship but ended as family friends..Until now that I have kids, they come visit me or me with my kids go and visit them..
    Can I share your site to some friends who are asking on how to hire a nanny?
    And to the readers planning to hire a nanny,I have a relative working in Hongkong and willing to work and stay with a good family here.

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    1. Jenn ElyseNovember 25, 2014 at 5:02 PM

      Hi Brigitte,

      Thanks for commenting, and glad to hear that you're enjoying the blog! It is always so nice to hear from people (both families and nannies) who have had such positive experiences going the route of a nanny. By all means, I welcome you to share my site with your friends. :-) On Sundays, I include warm and happy stories about families and nannies. If you'd be interested in sharing your story of your experience with your employers that are now friends, please feel free to email me (there is an email button on the home page) and we can chat about you submitting your story.

      Delete
  5. AnonymousFebruary 17, 2015 at 7:24 PM

    Hi there! I am navigating my way through the LMIA and this is the first site after COUNTLESS hours of researching online that has proved very useful. Thank you so much for actually taking the time to write the process out.
    I had two main questions, one of which was answered in the above comments (getting the prospective employee to sign the employee contract before submitting the LMIA-sounds like it can be left unsigned...?) and my other question was about WSIB. I am under the impression that this might be a very NEW rule, so maybe you did not need to get WSIB coverage...but on the LMIA on page 11 one of the required documents to submit is WSIB clearance letter/certificate. I was under the impression I did not need to get WSIB until the work permit was approved, and the nanny was on her way to Canada so that it was effective as of her date of arrival. Have you already acquired WSIB?
    thanks so much for your help

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    1. Jenn ElyseFebruary 17, 2015 at 7:49 PM

      Thanks for your comment! I am always so thrilled to hear about my blog being helpful. You just made my night! Answers to your questions:

      1) Yes this is correct. Now as I mentioned above, I did have our future nanny print/sign/scan/email the signature page of the contract back to me to send in with it, as I felt more reassured this way knowing that I had proved that she's read through the contract and agreed to it. I have heard from other families that even this isn't necessary, but I would certainly recommend it given how easily it can be done.

      2) You are right, the WSIB requirement was not part of the LMIA applications prior to Nov 30th, so I have yet to set up my WSIB account and will plan on doing this when (as you say) she gets her work permit. From what I can see by doing some research on the clearance certificates, it looks like (and now I'm speculating) the government would require this to ensure two things, 1) that you actually get WSIB (as this has been an issue in the past), and 2) that you are eligible to get WSIB coverage (in good standing with them etc).

      Now having said that, if you want to fork out a bit of $$ to save yourself the headache then I have some good news...I have a post on Payroll How-To which features (among other services) Nanny Tax (nannytax.ca). Nanny Tax within their tax services (payroll, CRA remittance, T4 creation etc), will automate your WSIB premium monthly based on your payroll, and for a $50 one-time fee, they will even register and set up your WSIB account too!

      Delete
  6. AmyFebruary 22, 2015 at 5:45 PM

    hi again,
    I inquired about the WSIB part, and it is now required to get a letter from WSIB saying that you have contacted them and to send it in with your LMIA. When I spoke with WSIB they said they were just starting to see this issue come up (as they don't even want to register you as an employer until you have employees - so they may need to update this to coincide with what Service Canada wants for this application). .....anyway ...I am hoping to submit my LMIA tomorrow and I have a question about qualifications of those you 'turned down' for the job.
    Did you chose your nanny from those who applied through job bank (or some other advertising you were required to do)..and what were your reasons for turning down canadian residents/Perm. residents? Mine are all no child care experience/no related schooling but I know that Service Canada (through the LMIA page) says that bringing a TFW to be a nanny must have related experience/schooling. You mentioned narrowing down your selection due to things like having no cover letter, or stating certain character traits, but you could not use such things as reasons why you did not hire canadians...correct?

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  7. AmyFebruary 22, 2015 at 5:56 PM

    ...I guess I should try to be more specific, I think that was confusing. On your LMIA, what did you put as the minimum requirements of the job?
    I know that the TFW needs to meet certain criteria in terms of skills and experience/schooling, but do we get to choose the minimum requirements or is that something that is determined already? (could I say that I wanted a Canadian/permanent residents to have ECE diploma, and minimum 2 years experience) or can I not deny Canadians for having less than that?

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    1. Jenn ElyseMarch 6, 2015 at 4:24 PM

      Hi Amy,

      Thanks for your question/comment. I hope I'm not too late getting back to you! I normally try to respond to questions within a day or two, but have been delayed as I was in major party planning mode for my son's 1st Birthday party last weekend and have been a bit MIA the past week as this is my final week of maternity leave.

      In answer to your question, we actually did cite some of what you mentioned above (from one of my prior posts) on our LMIA application. We cited "incomplete applications" as a main reason which were those who did not submit cover letter. We also cited "unqualified applicants" and provided further explanation that this was anyone with 1) no childcare experience, 2) no childcare education, 3) irrelevant job experience.

      To answer the second part of your question, I'm afraid I can't be of much help as I am not sure of the formal guidelines around minimum requirements and Canadian/permanent resident denial. I believe I wrote a couple of posts on our recruitment experience, but we literally only received 2 viable applications, one from a permanent resident who never replied to our emails, and another from a Canadian who wanted to only work 4 days/week with no flexibility being offered to their employer, the rest were all people who were completely unqualified which I had no problem citing on the LMIA application.

      I would imagine that it would be appropriate to turn down Canadian residents based on specific criteria that you've set out for the job (as you can with any job) so long as you have set the same criteria for overseas applicants, however this is just speculation, I do not have an informed answer for you on this part of the question, so please do check with a government rep if you decide to go this route and don't just take my word for it.

      I hope I've been helpful! Best of luck!

      Delete
  8. KSApril 20, 2015 at 9:25 AM

    Hi....on the LMIA i got confused with the following question: Do you plan to hire or train Canadians/permanent residents for the position(s) for which you are requesting an opinion? I did plan but following search got no good applicant...so is my answer NO?

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    1. Jenn ElyseApril 21, 2015 at 7:28 PM

      Hi KS. It looks as if they changed the question. The question used to be worded " Have you attempted to recruit Canadians citizens/permanent residents for this job?" and so the answer was of course "yes" as we attempted to recruit a Canadian but couldn't find one qualified who could meet the requirements of the job, but the new question wording of "plan to..." seems strange because of course you're not planning to now but were prior to attempting to recruitment. I would call the CIC number and seek clarification on the wording of that question. The number (unless it's recently changed under the new rules) is: 1-800-367-5693. Good luck!

      Delete
    2. AnonymousNovember 11, 2015 at 3:47 PM

      I am also looking for some information/direction on this... Has anyone answered the question "Do you plan to hire or train Canadians/permanent residents for the position(s) for which you are requesting an LMIA?"? I am stuck on this question in the LMIA because I'm looking for a trained/experienced caregiver and was not planning on training someone for the position...

      Delete
    3. Jenn ElyseNovember 11, 2015 at 7:34 PM

      Thanks for your question. I have always interpreted the question around training as being synonymous with orientation. They're not referring to 'training' in the sense of building capacity of someone with no relevant skills and experience. They are asking if you plan to hire and train a Canadian as you would in any job in any industry. The intention and commitment to hiring and training Canadian workers is a requirement of the LICP program as foreign workers are intended to be hired after you've done everything in your power to provide work to Canadians and permanent residents. Of course what we know is that most families (myself included) found that the Canadians looking for the work were either significantly under-qualified or not interested in the roles and responsibilities that we were looking for within the job, but what that question is seeking is a commitment from you that you will do due diligence in first trying to hire someone domestic.

      Delete
    4. AnonymousNovember 12, 2015 at 3:07 PM

      Thank you so much for your response to my question. You basically confirmed what I believed to be the intent of the question while providing a better explanation than I probably would have received from other sources. Thank you!

      Delete
    5. Jenn ElyseNovember 12, 2015 at 6:59 PM

      You're very welcome. :-)

      Delete
  9. AnonymousDecember 4, 2015 at 2:49 PM

    Hi Jenn,

    You 're so kind to share your great experiences on the Nanny program. I want to recruit a foreign nanny to assist for household duties ( I have two children with 13, 17 years old and 75 years old mother in law ) I'm not planning to have a new baby :) I'm really appreciate if you have any ideas for getting LMIA for the case ? Thank you so much!

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    1. Jenn ElyseMarch 6, 2017 at 5:25 PM

      Hi there, so sorry for the delay in reply, there was a glitch in the system and I didn't see this comment until now. I would love to hear how it ended up going with your LMIA? I am not familiar with the guidelines for hiring eldercare, and would love to learn more.

      Delete
  10. ENceJune 6, 2016 at 10:12 PM

    Hi. YOu have mentioned that you have categorized the applicants but you did not mentioned any names, right? and did you include copy of resumes of applicants?

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    1. Jenn ElyseMarch 6, 2017 at 5:26 PM

      No I didn't mention any names. I drafted a table that categorized applicants based on "not qualified", "qualified, offered interview, never responded", and a few others based on specific circumstances. I then just cited the number of applications in each category and took screen shots of emails where the candidates didn't reply. I didn't include copies of resumes/cover letters.

      Delete
  11. AnonymousJanuary 27, 2017 at 2:29 PM

    Hi Jenn, very helpful site. Thanks fir this Jenn! Im currently doing the application for my live in caregiver I just received the approval from job bank this morning. :)

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    1. Jenn ElyseMarch 6, 2017 at 5:27 PM

      I'm so happy you've found the site helpful. Amazing news on the job bank! Keep me posted on the progress with the application. Good luck!

      Delete
  12. AnonymousFebruary 7, 2017 at 12:35 PM

    Hello I am sending ym application but have questions of what to put in her contract. in terms of notice before taking vacation what to put there?

    thanks

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  13. David HMarch 6, 2017 at 2:54 PM

    Hi Jenn.
    I just got a LMIA application failure/rejection notice and yours and others' warnings about persnickity-ness are well founded. I got tripped up on the advertising requirements which were 99% there.

    I'm going to try to appeal it somehow, but one of my arguments is that the spirit of the requirements is to ensure a good selection of candidates.
    What is a good number do you think? I got 154 applicants from my ad campaign (58 were Canadian or PRs).

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    1. Jenn ElyseMarch 6, 2017 at 5:30 PM

      Hi David,

      Thanks for your comment. Sorry to hear that you got rejected on those grounds! Yes they definitely are quite 'thorough'. I would say that 154 applicants is plenty (and in and around the same ballpark that we had). Did you provide in-depth information about the applicants? We sorted them into a table based on "unqualified", "qualified, offered interview, never responded" "not suitable" (ie. wanted different working hours etc). Then I provided screenshots and copies of email correspondence showing that I had reached out to several candidates and offered an interview or more information about the job with no response. Best of luck with the appeal, that's so frustrating!

      Delete
    2. David HMarch 6, 2017 at 7:06 PM

      Hey Jenn.
      I have a very comprehensive list of all the applications (spreadsheet with pivot tables) but there was no actual requirement to submit such a thing. And the agent hasn't requested it. (I did reveal the Canadians count and a summary of the rejection reasons during the phone interview but she seemed nonplussed.)
      In my email appeal, I will throw in a few statistical things to see if that throws a wrench in her conclusion that I "failed to test the Canadian labour market accurately."
      Patience, be mine....

      Delete
  14. David HMarch 6, 2017 at 3:09 PM

    On the up-side, they made this decision in less than 4 weeks.

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    1. Jenn ElyseMarch 6, 2017 at 5:30 PM

      And thanks for sharing that because it's great to know what the timelines are like these days!

      Delete
  15. AnonymousApril 22, 2017 at 2:10 PM

    Hi Jenn,
    Your blog is really very informative and helpful as I have been helping my sister-in-law fill up an LMIA application. I just have 1 question though, is my sister-in-law and her husband considered 1 employer or are they employer #1 and #2?
    I initially just put my sister-in-law as employer #1 and then put N.A. under employer #2 but then I read somewhere that for childcare, both parents are usually listed as employers.
    I would greatly appreciate your help.
    Thanks a lot, GCC Gomez.

    ReplyDelete

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